( APE ) Gear ( 3rd/4th )

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cabacita
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( APE ) Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

Hello again,

Is better to change 3rd and/or 4th gear, when engine is tuned??

If yes, wich is the best to go regarding city traffic and touring?

regards,
Nuno
Ultima modifica di cabacita il gio feb 16, 2012 11:38 pm, modificato 1 volta in totale.
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general_lee
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da general_lee »

Hi,if you have an engine up to classical 102,like 115 or 130,is suitable to change the 4th. This depends obviously if you would a longer or shorter 4th gear ratio,and also depends on your engine. Here in Italy we've got Zadra and DRT that make the gear of the fourth shorter than normal,to allow the engine to rev up without hesitation. If you prefer to drive normally at steady torque with low fuel consumption,you should have a original 4th,or if you prefer a responsive engine to uphill or winding roads,or just for fun,you should mount a shorter 4th.
Have ou got some money,like 600€ for your ape? You can order to FAIO (by DRT) a 5-speed gearbox,for better power management, but you need an engine of at least 130cc ;)
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erossinelli (gio gen 19, 2012 12:33 am)
alevena92 ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:riflessione spirituale o alcolica? :badgrin:
Seriamente, ero in una comunità di monaci!
spyrox85 ha scritto:e basta che non gli hai spaventati dicendo , "aaaah per iniziare bene la mattina devo farmi un cappuccino!" :mrgreen:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

Hi,
thank you for your reply. My set will be:

kit malossi 115cc
crankshaft DRT ( c45 ?? ) http://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/produ ... r_45085000
dellorto shbc 19/19E ( already have it, but probably will go for higher one ) :doubt:
gearing 24/72 plus clutch with 4 plates and malossi reinforced spring x 1
exhaust polini banana sport

Most of my driving is at city/village ( home » work » return and our landscape is like mountain / open roads, turns, uphill etc. ), during weekend a few touring with Vespa guys around our region with the same landscape. Maybe 50/70kms ride!
My biggest difficulty or need is mostly uphill, so if i understand your opinion i should go to a shorter 4th!

Right now, my fuel consumption is about 7lts / 100km ( 98 with 2% )

No no, i can not continue spend euros . We are in crisis! :evil:

Which one would you suggest? It´s easy to assemble it? Only necessary to change the plate or something else is needed?

Thanks for your advice,
Nuno
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general_lee
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da general_lee »

cabacita ha scritto:Hi,
thank you for your reply. My set will be:

kit malossi 115cc
crankshaft DRT ( c45 ?? ) http://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/produ ... r_45085000
dellorto shbc 19/19E ( already have it, but probably will go for higher one ) :doubt:
gearing 24/72 plus clutch with 4 plates and malossi reinforced spring x 1
exhaust polini banana sport

Most of my driving is at city/village ( home » work » return and our landscape is like mountain / open roads, turns, uphill etc. ), during weekend a few touring with Vespa guys around our region with the same landscape. Maybe 50/70kms ride!
My biggest difficulty or need is mostly uphill, so if i understand your opinion i should go to a shorter 4th!

Right now, my fuel consumption is about 7lts / 100km ( 98 with 2% )

No no, i can not continue spend euros . We are in crisis! :evil:

Which one would you suggest? It´s easy to assemble it? Only necessary to change the plate or something else is needed?

Thanks for your advice,
Nuno
uh,115...i think you can mount the 22/63 ratios because are best suited for your type of engine and especially for the type of landscape,but keeping the original 4th ;)
For the carburetor,you have to buy a dell'orto phbg21,the 19shbc is too old-fashioned and it ends up that fuel consumption's like mounting a phbl24 while having less performances
alevena92 ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:riflessione spirituale o alcolica? :badgrin:
Seriamente, ero in una comunità di monaci!
spyrox85 ha scritto:e basta che non gli hai spaventati dicendo , "aaaah per iniziare bene la mattina devo farmi un cappuccino!" :mrgreen:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

Thank you for your reply.

The difference between 24/72 and 22/63, is that big?? I already have it, for long time not sure if i can send it back. Just like the carburetor... :|

Whats the difference between shbc, phbg and phbl??? I never understood these acronyms :doubt:
I'm always with doubts, because my oilç pump is off, so never sure which carb is good!!

Regards,
Nuno
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general_lee
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da general_lee »

cabacita ha scritto:Thank you for your reply.

The difference between 24/72 and 22/63, is that big?? I already have it, for long time not sure if i can send it back. Just like the carburetor... :|

Whats the difference between shbc, phbg and phbl??? I never understood these acronyms :doubt:
I'm always with doubts, because my oilç pump is off, so never sure which carb is good!!

Regards,
Nuno
oil pump? lol remove it and do manually the mix :D the difference between 24/72 and 22/63 is that in your type of landscape, the engine tries less and therefore you should not stay at full throttle to rev up when you go on a hill.
Don't care about acronyms,is enough to know that PHBG and PHBL is the latest design,so fluiddynamic technology is more developed that SHBCs,this means more power and less fuel consumption if them are well carburetted ;)
alevena92 ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:riflessione spirituale o alcolica? :badgrin:
Seriamente, ero in una comunità di monaci!
spyrox85 ha scritto:e basta che non gli hai spaventati dicendo , "aaaah per iniziare bene la mattina devo farmi un cappuccino!" :mrgreen:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

general_lee ha scritto:
cabacita ha scritto:Thank you for your reply.

The difference between 24/72 and 22/63, is that big?? I already have it, for long time not sure if i can send it back. Just like the carburetor... :|

Whats the difference between shbc, phbg and phbl??? I never understood these acronyms :doubt:
I'm always with doubts, because my oilç pump is off, so never sure which carb is good!!

Regards,
Nuno
oil pump? lol remove it and do manually the mix :D the difference between 24/72 and 22/63 is that in your type of landscape, the engine tries less and therefore you should not stay at full throttle to rev up when you go on a hill.
Don't care about acronyms,is enough to know that PHBG and PHBL is the latest design,so fluiddynamic technology is more developed that SHBCs,this means more power and less fuel consumption if them are well carburetted ;)

Yes, is off. I do my own mix ( 98 oct + 2% oil ). It's still there, but not working.

24/72 to have speed at straight open roads, turns, etc with short 4th gear
22/63 to have more power uphill with low rpms and keep original 4th gear
With the 22/63 will i loose speed?

something like this, correct?? :o


Ohh ok, thanks for the teaching :wink:
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general_lee
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da general_lee »

cabacita ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:
cabacita ha scritto:Thank you for your reply.

The difference between 24/72 and 22/63, is that big?? I already have it, for long time not sure if i can send it back. Just like the carburetor... :|

Whats the difference between shbc, phbg and phbl??? I never understood these acronyms :doubt:
I'm always with doubts, because my oilç pump is off, so never sure which carb is good!!

Regards,
Nuno
oil pump? lol remove it and do manually the mix :D the difference between 24/72 and 22/63 is that in your type of landscape, the engine tries less and therefore you should not stay at full throttle to rev up when you go on a hill.
Don't care about acronyms,is enough to know that PHBG and PHBL is the latest design,so fluiddynamic technology is more developed that SHBCs,this means more power and less fuel consumption if them are well carburetted ;)

Yes, is off. I do my own mix ( 98 oct + 2% oil ). It's still there, but not working.

24/72 to have speed at straight open roads, turns, etc with short 4th gear
22/63 to have more power uphill with low rpms and keep original 4th gear
With the 22/63 will i loose speed?

something like this, correct?? :o


Ohh ok, thanks for the teaching :wink:
exactly! you understood very well that I meant for differences between ratios ;)
alevena92 ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:riflessione spirituale o alcolica? :badgrin:
Seriamente, ero in una comunità di monaci!
spyrox85 ha scritto:e basta che non gli hai spaventati dicendo , "aaaah per iniziare bene la mattina devo farmi un cappuccino!" :mrgreen:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

Thank you general_lee for your help.

Now, i'm having difficulties to find the carb that you advise: dellorto PHBG 21!

Is there a kit, with everything?? Filter, carb, intake, etc???

Thanks once again,
Nuno
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general_lee
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da general_lee »

cabacita ha scritto:Thank you general_lee for your help.

Now, i'm having difficulties to find the carb that you advise: dellorto PHBG 21!

Is there a kit, with everything?? Filter, carb, intake, etc???

Thanks once again,
Nuno
maybe it can be a kit like intake collector-filter-carburetor,on DellOrto or Polini web site there's all you need ;) or you can also search that on eBay
alevena92 ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:riflessione spirituale o alcolica? :badgrin:
Seriamente, ero in una comunità di monaci!
spyrox85 ha scritto:e basta che non gli hai spaventati dicendo , "aaaah per iniziare bene la mattina devo farmi un cappuccino!" :mrgreen:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

general_lee ha scritto:
cabacita ha scritto:Thank you general_lee for your help.

Now, i'm having difficulties to find the carb that you advise: dellorto PHBG 21!

Is there a kit, with everything?? Filter, carb, intake, etc???

Thanks once again,
Nuno
maybe it can be a kit like intake collector-filter-carburetor,on DellOrto or Polini web site there's all you need ;) or you can also search that on eBay
Yes, thats what i'm looking for at sipscooterschop and ebay.it. At sip, not find it yet and at ebay, not easy to find someone that will ship it to portugal :?
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general_lee
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da general_lee »

cabacita ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:
cabacita ha scritto:Thank you general_lee for your help.

Now, i'm having difficulties to find the carb that you advise: dellorto PHBG 21!

Is there a kit, with everything?? Filter, carb, intake, etc???

Thanks once again,
Nuno
maybe it can be a kit like intake collector-filter-carburetor,on DellOrto or Polini web site there's all you need ;) or you can also search that on eBay
Yes, thats what i'm looking for at sipscooterschop and ebay.it. At sip, not find it yet and at ebay, not easy to find someone that will ship it to portugal :?
this goes very well also for ape ;) http://viewitem.eim.ebay.pt/dellorto-ph ... 88104/item
alevena92 ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:riflessione spirituale o alcolica? :badgrin:
Seriamente, ero in una comunità di monaci!
spyrox85 ha scritto:e basta che non gli hai spaventati dicendo , "aaaah per iniziare bene la mattina devo farmi un cappuccino!" :mrgreen:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

thanks, most of the times i'm confused, because they don't say piaggio ape!!!!

two more questions please:

which intake manifold and air filter should i get? malossi, polini, stage6???

Jets, from where should i start to fine tuning motor?? I have one set of 5mm malossi jets, from 78 to 102!!

Thank you one more time for your great help!! :D
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general_lee
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da general_lee »

cabacita ha scritto:thanks, most of the times i'm confused, because they don't say piaggio ape!!!!

two more questions please:

which intake manifold and air filter should i get? malossi, polini, stage6???

Jets, from where should i start to fine tuning motor?? I have one set of 5mm malossi jets, from 78 to 102!!

Thank you one more time for your great help!! :D
i'll reply you in portuguese because in english there are many false-friends so they take out your understanding.
para aspiração, você pode usar uma luva de borracha que combina múltiplas e carburador,como um filtro, o polini "shell" é o mais adequado para o Ape, porque tem buracos que podem bloquear para fazer uma correta mistura de combustível ;)
como jactos poderia começar com uma 100 ou assim, então você ajusta de acordo com a resposta do motore.poi usando o parafuso do lado do ar do carburador faze mais preciso carburacion ;)
alevena92 ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:riflessione spirituale o alcolica? :badgrin:
Seriamente, ero in una comunità di monaci!
spyrox85 ha scritto:e basta che non gli hai spaventati dicendo , "aaaah per iniziare bene la mattina devo farmi un cappuccino!" :mrgreen:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

:wink: i don't mind about false friends, i'm here to learn and hope so in the future teach someone, just like few of you are doing with me. But, i appreciate your effort and patient :D

So i can use rubber manifold to attached to carburetor and use polini filter shell shape, that makes correct air / fuel mixture.

With the jets, i can start with 100 or like so, i then fine tune using air screw.

Wouldn't be better to use a straight ( alloy ) manifold?

Thank you,
nuno
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general_lee
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da general_lee »

cabacita ha scritto::wink: i don't mind about false friends, i'm here to learn and hope so in the future teach someone, just like few of you are doing with me. But, i appreciate your effort and patient :D

So i can use rubber manifold to attached to carburetor and use polini filter shell shape, that makes correct air / fuel mixture.

With the jets, i can start with 100 or like so, i then fine tune using air screw.

Wouldn't be better to use a straight ( alloy ) manifold?

Thank you,
nuno
all manifolds for ape are straight :D also rubber manifold is straight because it is only fitting between carburetor and original collector...and have less risk to be broken with the vibrations (because the aluminum manifolds are long and hard)
alevena92 ha scritto:
general_lee ha scritto:riflessione spirituale o alcolica? :badgrin:
Seriamente, ero in una comunità di monaci!
spyrox85 ha scritto:e basta che non gli hai spaventati dicendo , "aaaah per iniziare bene la mattina devo farmi un cappuccino!" :mrgreen:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

general_lee ha scritto:
cabacita ha scritto::wink: i don't mind about false friends, i'm here to learn and hope so in the future teach someone, just like few of you are doing with me. But, i appreciate your effort and patient :D

So i can use rubber manifold to attached to carburetor and use polini filter shell shape, that makes correct air / fuel mixture.

With the jets, i can start with 100 or like so, i then fine tune using air screw.

Wouldn't be better to use a straight ( alloy ) manifold?

Thank you,
nuno
all manifolds for ape are straight :D also rubber manifold is straight because it is only fitting between carburetor and original collector...and have less risk to be broken with the vibrations (because the aluminum manifolds are long and hard)
humm!!! ok, got it :wink:
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

hello again,
one more question:

Is easier or/and better to start to change the gear it self or start to change input shaft??'
thank you,
nuno
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

anyone??' :D

something like this is enough??

http://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/produ ... 5_4043205a
cabacita
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Re: Ape Gear ( 3rd/4th )

Messaggio da leggere da cabacita »

already have the answer, it will do!
thanks general :supz:
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